Forum Message

Topic: Re:First Access
Posted by: John Grinder and Carmen Bostic St. Clair
Date/Time: 25/11/2002 23:41:29

Hi Lewis

We enjoyed your posting - thanks.

You asked,

"Is the representation at First access available to consciousness or does it only become so following f2 transformations?"

First Access (FA) is the first point where we gain access to the results of the f1 transforms. And yes, we are indeed as conscious of the events presented at FA as you are presently of the words that you are reading in this posing. Note that we are distinguishing being conscious of events from any self conscious system. This (self conscious or self reflexive systems occur post f2 mapppings. 

You go on to state,

"My naive understanding is that you can have a VAK representation which can be manipulated via submodality techniques allowing change and that is first access. F2 transformations would be changing the meaning of the VAK by verbal reframing. However I'm not then certain of the location of "unconscious" representations!"

The VAK representations that inform FA can be manipulated in any number of ways (you mention one - submodalities) - for example, all uses of non-verbal anchoring are manipulations of FA constructs. We propose a much stronger positions for f2 transforms then simply verbal reframing. Indeed, we would propose that meaning in the naive sense at any rate is created by the partitions imposed on FA by f2 transforms (which includes but is not limited to language mappings).  The location of unconscious representations is in fact, FA.

You continue with,

"In neurology, in the conditioning of fear responses, the amygdyla can store non-conscious memories which can be reactivated giving a feeling dread for "no apparent reason" (consciously). Is this the same mechanism as First access?"

The representations stored in the amygdyla are FA representations that have never been mapped by f2 transforms - this is the sense in which "no apparent reason" is an appropriate first approximation to appreciating the epistemology we propose in Whispering - that is, "reason" as in the phrase, "no apparent reason" is a completely f2 generated set of logical operations. Since the unconscous FA representations stored in the amygdyla have never been mapped by f2 transforms, they are not available post FA as have never been subjected to the manipulations of f2 transforms where reason reigns. This is the point of the Iatrogenic Principle presented in the latter portions of Whispering as an ethical constraint on interventions. Please consider once again the arguments in the early epistemological section of Whispering - especially the distinctions between the logics of the products of the f1 transforms(FA) and the logic of the f2 transforms - the example of the child sorting a heap of toys, for example.

Please continue with your contributions.

All the best,

Carmen and John

Entire Thread

TopicDate PostedPosted By
First Access24/11/2002 18:58:25Lewis Walker
     Re:First Access25/11/2002 23:41:29John Grinder and Carmen Bostic St. Clair
          Re:Re:First Access26/11/2002 21:56:31Lewis Walker

Forum Home