Forum Message

Topic: Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions
Posted by: John Grinder
Date/Time: 14/06/2002 16:10:41


My point was that there are no "proper" presuppositions/beliefs - in the sense that all of them have the consequence of reducing experience.

Now, it seems to me that there is an impeccable epistemological strategy available - namely, the way that training is conducted by the trainer with respect to the perceptual position of the learner - on pages 355-356 in Whispering, we comment,

"...the basis of effective training is the creation by the trainer of a series of contexts in which through experience the student may arrive at his own direct tacit knowledge of the patterning. In other words, the measure of effective training is whether the student can do it, never whether he can talk about it."


"...that the ideal design of training inherently involves discovery processes by which the student achieves unconscious (tacit) competency prior to achieving explicit verbal competency. A pattern discovered belongs to the discoverer; a pattern presented belongs to the presenter."

I suppose that ultimately, we are speaking here once again of epistemology - I am certain that there are aspects of NLP patterning presently proposed that are, at best, poorly coded - if the learner is induced into this enterprise with presuppositions that reduce their experience (by definition) then how will corrective actions and refinements come to the patterning?

Clearly, Carmen and I have taken the position that if presuppositions are dispensed with, then the fresh perspectives of new participants will result in a self-correcting and self-refining process for NLP itself.

All the best,


Entire Thread

TopicDate PostedPosted By
NLP-Presuppositions10/06/2002 23:30:45Wolfgang Karber
     Re:NLP-Presuppositions11/06/2002 17:59:51John Grinder
          Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions12/06/2002 11:03:23Wolfgang Karber
               Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions12/06/2002 16:44:07John Grinder
                    Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions12/06/2002 22:54:20Wolfgang Karber
                         ReRe:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions13/06/2002 13:58:28kc
                              Re:ReRe:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions13/06/2002 16:03:23John Grinder
                                   ReRe:Re:ReRe:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions13/06/2002 21:52:52kc
                    Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions14/06/2002 11:10:49Wolfgang Karber
                         Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions14/06/2002 16:10:41John Grinder
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions02/03/2003 02:15:30Ernest
                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions02/03/2003 16:24:07John Grinder
                                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions04/03/2003 00:46:37ernest
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions04/03/2003 02:00:05John Grinder
                                                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions04/03/2003 12:42:08Ernest
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions02/03/2003 02:26:27Ernest
                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions02/03/2003 16:30:40John Grinder
                                        ReReRe:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:NLP-Presuppositions14/04/2003 23:27:04Ernest

Forum Home