Hello, Rob Manson. 1.  In reply to your posting dated 31/01/2003 13:12:54 in thread "Modeling how to's??", Dr. Grinder wrote, "4. You wrote, 'I also think it's seriously relevant because many people who read and accept your modelling model in Whispering may struggle with gaining access to their chosen model.  For example I may want to model how Bill Gates has repeatedly been able to build apps that create world wide monopolies, but I doubt I'll be able to easily gain the required level of access to this specific model.' Look RobMan, we never said that it was easy to model geniuses only that it is an adventure of the highest order. Have you actually attempted to gain access or is this whining I hear? Look, the difficult nearly alway looks, sounds and feels impossible until you make a full commitment and get off your butt and do it." 2.  To reply to Dr. Grinder's posting dated 31/01/2003 18:36:50 in thread "Modeling how to's??" you posted to this thread titled "Design", in the post that this post replies to.  You wrote, "You wrote: 'Look RobMan, we never said that it was easy to model geniuses only that it is an adventure of the highest order.  Have you actually attempted to gain access or is this whining I hear?' Listen joHn, I'm not disagreeing with you...just discussing some thoughts on the interaction between modelling and design - specifically at the unconscious level...but feel free to hear that as whining if you like... 8) You wrote: 'Look..get off your butt and do it.' Thanks...I am..." In writing his post dated 31/01/2003 18:36:50 in thread "Modeling how to's", Dr. Grinder may have been encouraging you to model, Rob Manson. By his use of the term "model", Dr. Grinder may have refered to the type of modeling that he and Ms. Bostic St. Clair describe in "Whispering In The Wind", where you can imitate, act like, and perceive another human being in the flesh, the person who is your source model. -nj