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Topic: Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)
Posted by: John Schertzer
Date/Time: 27/08/2003 15:30:12

t,
Ethical criteria for one's own work is hopefully different from what one may wish to impose on others.  I don't believe I would tell a Saudi that it is wrong to make his wife walk several paces behind him, though I don't have that kind of relationship with my wife.  We're talking about many different cultures here, and in some cases, very different desired outcomes.

A client and therapist have chosen a particular type or relationship that may involve varying degrees of process and content.  I don't actually believe that there is a clean delineation between form (or process) and content to begin with, a point at which I may differ with JG and St. Clare.  But John even says at one point in whispering that the difference between form and content is one of logical levels, and that what might be form on one level is content on another.

Is using metaphorical intervention content free?  Is it sometimes, never, always?  And if it is at times content free, at what point does it become venturing into content?  It is also possible to argue, by nature of the map vs. territory presupposition, that all communication is metaphorical and therefore content free.

Depending on what logical level you're working at, as we said before, the language you're using may be transformed from content to form, or vice versa.  What if a client comes to you complaining that their pictures are all fuzzy and they want to learn how to make them clear.  Then submods, usually considered an aspect of form, have become the content of the conversation.  Where do you go from there?  A smart psychoanalyst may take any complaint as a metaphor for something else, something inexplicable.  Lacan's psychoanalysis, in fact, has a term for this inexplicable aspect.  He calls it "The Real," and defines it as something that is the root or source of a complex that can never be known (correct me if I'm wrong), or known only through questionable associations.  This is perhaps sometimes even more content free than NLP is.  His thinking was very influenced by a different kind of structuralist linguistics, btw.

best,
JS


Entire Thread

TopicDate PostedPosted By
Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)16/08/2003 11:16:55Jumbo
     Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)17/08/2003 04:10:53Ryan Nagy
          Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)17/08/2003 10:44:10Mark MacLean
          Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)17/08/2003 10:52:16Jumbo
          Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)18/08/2003 02:42:10Jerry Freidinger
               Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)18/08/2003 19:09:34Ryan Nagy
                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)18/08/2003 20:04:18John Schertzer
                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)19/08/2003 04:06:22Jerry
                         Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)23/08/2003 04:16:07Ryan
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)23/08/2003 16:01:22Jerry
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)24/08/2003 08:24:54Stephen Bray
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)25/08/2003 18:25:37John Schertzer
                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)25/08/2003 22:05:46Shelly Douglas
                                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)26/08/2003 07:31:18Stephen Bray
                                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)26/08/2003 14:20:03John Schertzer
                                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)26/08/2003 14:35:48John Schertzer
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)26/08/2003 16:38:01Stephen Bray
                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)25/08/2003 22:24:54Ryan Nagy
                                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)26/08/2003 21:42:09John Schertzer
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 06:02:18t
                                                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 07:53:56Stephen Bray
                                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 16:18:10John Schertzer
                                                            Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 18:14:46Stephen Bray
                                                                 Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 19:05:38John Schertzer
                                                                      Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)01/09/2003 07:34:44Ryan Nagy
                                                                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)02/09/2003 04:11:05t
                                                                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)02/09/2003 13:54:35John Schertzer
                                                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 15:30:12John Schertzer
                                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 17:20:05t
                                                            Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)27/08/2003 21:48:57John Schertzer
     Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)18/08/2003 03:18:27williams
     Re:Dilts Logical Levels! (pseudo-science)31/08/2003 01:52:47t

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