John Grinder John I read your reply as I have more time this morning so let me reply back here. I do agree in your reply to me yesterday with your agreement with my first point about my description of "SUBJECTIVE EXPERIENCE" and the redundancy in the phrase which leads and allows me to also question my  "objective experience" and its redundancy. Which then makes me ask myself does my objective experience come from my same personal filter system and am I basically redundant when I look at new objective experience also? H'mm..I am uncertain here where to go next. So say John using another perceptual position or new filter system ( opps there I go again ) could be quite useful? ..But do we have enough time John to keep points, reposition ourselves mentally and do comprehend in our fast paced world to be more subjective ....objective ...! good morning kc ps. John I have more questions on page 276 on your perceptions on your use of requsite variety in your therapy sessions. That page 276 kicks the dog let me tell you! Thanks again!